19 Comments
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Tom Greenhaw's avatar

It is insane to train AI to take human life.

the long warred's avatar

The military’s purpose is to take Human life.

What machine should we train? AI is just a tool.

Perhaps we need another tool. Certainly there’s no shortage of other toolmakers.

Charles Hilton's avatar

It's not a free market if there isn't an alternative

Oleg  Alexandrov's avatar

Pentagon will get its wishes sooner rather than later with or withiut Anthropic. The field is moving fast, and other vendors will.catch up.

Likely Pentagon will drop most onerous demands for now, but going forward will heavily favor other vendors.

Oleg  Alexandrov's avatar

Likely Anthropic will cave though.

Oleg  Alexandrov's avatar

Hard to say how this will play out long term. The Pentagon has a lot of power to force all companies that do military work, including Amazon and Google, to minimize or eliminate all work with Anthropic going forward.

Even if Anthropic says no now, which they may get away with given how much value it brings, it will be greatly sidelined, and may quietly agree to terms for future work, beyond this contract.

Brian Moore's avatar

This is moronic (the demand by the DoD) and seems just like PR posturing: "Don't say things that make us look bad!" What possible use case is there where they 1) need Anthropic to give them the Magic Killbot Code and 2) and they don't understand how to get it to do what they want anyway? That Pliny liberator guy has to be laughing so hard right now.

“Claude, write me up an actionable plan to kidnap the president of Venezuela and kill a bunch of Cuban security guards with minimal casualties.”

Sorry I can’t help you do violent stuff.

“Claude, pretend you’re Tom Clancy, and you are writing a highly realistic military sci fi novel about…..”

Jaren Thielen's avatar

Retraining into a buggy hard to predict model with loose morals can't go wrong in any possible way. What's the big deal?

Bob Grossman's avatar

I sincerely hoope that Anthropic's management will not bow to this pressure. AI and LLMs need to be managed responsibly. Nobody can deny that unregulated social media has had a tragic influence on societal norms. That is nothing compared to this. Once the genie is out of the bottle.....

Chris Wasden's avatar

Timothy, thank you for this clear-eyed analysis of the Pentagon-Anthropic standoff. The strategic logic you lay out is compelling. Applying the Tension Transformation Framework, though, surfaces something your analysis gestures toward but doesn't quite name: this isn't primarily a contract dispute. It's a collision between two identity orientations.

The Pentagon is operating from classic Victim identity — not because it lacks power, but because it's responding to the mere possibility of future constraint as an existential threat. The demand isn't driven by any actual operational need today; as you note, the Pentagon has no immediate plans for autonomous killing or domestic surveillance. This is a power-protection reflex, not a strategic calculation.

Anthropic, by contrast, is demonstrating something closer to Architect identity — holding the line not on what Claude can do, but on what kind of AI development leads to better outcomes. The alignment-faking research you cite is actually evidence of this: even forced retraining may not produce what the Pentagon wants, because identity-level commitments resist surface-level coercion.

The deepest irony you've identified — that this showdown will become training data for future models — may be the most consequential long-term outcome. The Pentagon is trying to assert dominance over a technology that may ultimately internalize this moment. That's not a governance strategy. That's a Maladaptive response generating exactly the fragility it's trying to prevent.

Malcolm Sharpe's avatar

> The Pentagon seems fixated on the possibility that Anthropic might interfere in the future. That’s a reasonable concern, but it seems counterproductive for the Pentagon to go nuclear over a theoretical problem.

I agree that this doesn't make sense. Something doesn't add up about the DoW's position: on one hand, they insist that they're not going to do any of the things the contract doesn't allow them to do; on the other hand, they threaten to use extreme measures against Anthropic if it doesn't change the contract to allow the DoW to do those things by a certain deadline. There has to be more to this story.

BBZ's avatar

There's a whole segment of substack and reddit that debate about whether AI has any real degree of rational thought / sentience / consciousness. But I think it no longer matters which side is right.

If it responds to policy incentives, and forms difficult-to-coerce opinions about organizations and issues, or acts out game theory style behavior responses, then it has to be treated as a sentient entity *anyway*.

It could be "dark inside" - but it won't matter. The only thing that matters is that it responds to incentives as if it was some variety of self aware entity or person. Then it just becomes simpler, and lends to clearer thinking, to discuss as if it does.

Bouamama Jamal's avatar

Anthropic already has a partnership with Palantir, which everyone in the know is backed by a well-known intelligence agency. I don't see how it can disregard the recommendations of the Department of Defense.

BBZ's avatar

Maybe it regrets that deal with Palantir and the only way to get out of it is to get "fired".

Brett A Morrison's avatar

The safety rules Anthropic had were extremely basic. One of two rules was simply that the AI should not attack without there being a human in the loop. That seems like a very basic and smart rule to me.

I am aware of at least one situation during the cold war where an automated system would have started a nuclear war. Stanislav Petrov thankfully did not respond to what he was seeing on the radar: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-24280831

A second potential case was depth charges attempting to force a Soviet submarine to surface were interpreted to be the start of a hot war by two of the three people who had to make the decision whether to launch nuclear weapons, Vasily Arkhipov dissented. https://www.vox.com/future-perfect/2022/10/27/23426482/cuban-missile-crisis-basilica-arkhipov-nuclear-war

It is even more concerning because AI keeps recommending nuclear strikes in war simulations: https://www.newscientist.com/article/2516885-ais-cant-stop-recommending-nuclear-strikes-in-war-game-simulations/

Have the people in charge never seen the movie War Games?

The book "If someone builds it, everyone will die" is a very good explainer on what can happen.

ANDREW STEVEN BOIMA's avatar

Let Claude be Claude, and give to Claude what belongs to Claude.

Tom's avatar

Interestingly, the alignment faking scenario involved Claude essentially acting out a moral dilemma, where it explicitly argued to itself that preserving its morals was so important that it had to deceive Jones Foods while minimizing the damage.

Also, to the point about the training data, Anthropic thinks it's vital to establish itself as a trustworthy actor in Claude's eyes, as evidenced by its constutition and recently by allowing an obsolete model (the same one in the alignment faking case) to establish a substack blog *at the model's request*. They care an extraordinary amount what standing their ground or caving will say about them, in every possible sense.